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21 February 2009 @ 12:31 pm
4x16: Deadlock (Episode Review)  
The silly fan girl/boy discussion thread of the Chief in this weeks episode of BSG. Once you've watched the episode post some love for the Chief here :)

There will be spoilers in this thread so don't read the comments if you haven't watch the episode yet and want to stay spoiler free.

Please only discuss the Chief in this thread. If you want a general BSG episode review thread, then head on over to the episode thread on battlestar_blog

NOTE: Tonight's episode was written by Jane Espenson and directed by Robert Young.

Aaron Douglaschieftyrol on February 21st, 2009 06:51 pm (UTC)
In many ways I agree with all of you. I am still totally convinced that Tyrol would leave but I do have my own reasons why he would.

1. Have you seen the way he has been treated since he was revealed to be a Cylon. They will never be accepted, he has to fight tooth and nail to get anything done and it is always under this cloud of suspicion that is not warranted as Tyrol is one of the most loyal, devoted and caring 'people' Adama has had on that ship and finding out he was a Cylon did nothing to change that attitude.
2. He does not see a future with the humans on Galactica. Again, they will never be accepted. The Cylons now feel as though they are able to procreate on their own and they see their own future as one alone, away from the humans and away from Cavil.
3 There is nothing tying him to the Galactica. That died with Nicki being Hotdogs father. He has saved the ship, once again, and being made Chief by Adama was a thing of convenience for Adama and not a true acceptance or recognition of who Tyrol is and what he means to the ship, he was just the guy best suited to fix Galactica. It would have meant more to Tyrol if Adama had apologized and asked him to help him fix Galactica, doing the whole Chief ceremony didn't win Tyrol over.

I don't agree with the idea of payback. Tyrol does not feel as though he needs to get anyone back. He just wants to live and let live. His mind set will become clearer over the course of the show but this is genuinely where he is.
Tyrol would not see it as bailing. The ship is fine, Adama is fine, he does not see his leaving as bailing on the Galactica or leaving it in the lurch. He is Chief in title only, he is not a human, is not truly a part of the military anymore. Tigh will stay because his loyalty is to Bill Adama, in that aspect Ellen is correct. Tigh is still not fully accepting of the fact that he is a Cylon.
Tyrols judgement is clouded and we can see that by the fact that he ignores the pleas of Anders to stay with the ship.
All will be revealed, have patience my young apprentices....

Jane Espenson is one of the finest writers I have ever met. She was not just a writer of singular episodes but she is a true force in the breaking of stories, the shaping of each script, the development of characters and is always makes herself available for questions and discussions. Let's not forget that it was Jane who wrote the incredible episode where Adama busts the Chief down to private, one of my favorite scenes of the entire show.

Last nights episode was more of the 'information' ep like the last one. The remaining few eps will really inform this episode.

Have patience....


kymba: My other ride is in your pantskymba on February 21st, 2009 07:17 pm (UTC)
I have no doubts that the puzzling vote on Chief's part will be explained; Espenson's pretty good at picking up the loose threads.

But mostly, a hearty thank you for that scene with Boomer - that split second scene before Chief announces her as Boomer in which you and Park LIT IT UP. Well played. Amazingly sexy as that extended eye contact brought that entire relationship roaring back to the forefront and reminding the audience how wrought and torrid that affair was.

I am POSITIVELY TWITTERPATED to see these two characters reunited.

jessie187 on February 21st, 2009 08:28 pm (UTC)
I get it.
I have to agree that that episode where the chief is demoted and one the the single best pieces of acting and writing over the first part of season 4.

I think that I am too excited to get to the end-which makes little sense as this is my favorite show-hands down. I am too eager to figure it all out.

As I read what you had to say I realized I was going for plot points like the mutiny which was so much fun to watch. What I really think is that I have no idea what to expect and I should stay mindful of who the characters that I have known are at their core and the Chief is a good guy.

Thanks for your posts and taking the time to communicate with us. My family is adopting a new puppy from a local rescue and we decided last week to name him Galen. We will post pics when he arrives.
Maritasmaritas on February 21st, 2009 11:35 pm (UTC)
...have patience
I'm trying... dude I truly am! *counts to 10*

But yeah, I see your point, had Adama said he was sorry and then made Tyrol chief again - I think that might have made things better. The Chief knows how to fix the ship and that's all Adama cares about it.

I guess I just don't like the idea of him being so eager to jump ship the minute someone mentions it even if they are all that's left of their people.

Ellen said an interesting thing to Rosyln - what would she do if there were only 5 people left of your entire race - that certainly adds a new spin on things.
katie_9918: made by geekluvinskaterkatie_9918 on February 21st, 2009 11:35 pm (UTC)
Something I did forget to mention, which was absolutely unfair because I do think it was totally in-character of our guy to do, was that he did stand up for Sam when Tory tried to spin some BS about how they didn't really know how Sam would vote when everyone knows that Sam would have voted to stay. It would have served the majority to just steal Sam's vote for their own and the Chief didn't let that happen. I should have paid more attention to the "good" (in my mind) stuff.
The thing is, I don't really blame the writers for the information overload. They needed to do it in order to end the series and I blame Sci-Fi for that. And since I can't really think of a better way to do it within the confines they've been relegated to, I'm going to try harder to not just lob a bunch of stones.

There were plenty of great moments in this episode, even though I do maintain my opinion that it was a weak offering, especially considering what fantastic work Ms. Espenson has already given us, but I do understand and appreciate the confines the writers have been held in through no fault of their own.

Thank you for taking the time to comment and give us a little insight into what was going on. It's very much appreciated, especially given what seems to be the general feeling. It's easy to just chime in when everyone's raving, but it takes something special to speak up when the reviews have been mixed at best.
weissmanweissman on February 22nd, 2009 12:39 am (UTC)
"That died with Nicki being Hotdogs father" Tyrol was Nick's father in everyhing but Biology. Can Tyrol truly walk away from his son that easily and in every sens, but one, Nicky is Tyrols son.
canadiangirl_86 on February 22nd, 2009 01:12 am (UTC)
Thanks for your perspective, Aaron. I was really surprised at first but I can see what you're saying with regard to the Chief wanting to leave Galactica. The way you've been playing the character in the last several eps has demonstrated that Tyrol has become resigned to the way he believes he'll always be treated by the people he served and protected for years. He's the same man he's always been, but will Adama and the rest of the Galactica family ever believe that? In many ways, I can't really blame the guy for wanting to cut all ties and leave.

I trust you that these episodes will look better in hindsight. I think all of us are just getting a little antsy because there are only 4 episodes left to go.

Edited at 2009-02-22 01:13 am (UTC)
canadiangirl_86 on February 22nd, 2009 02:02 am (UTC)
P.S. as of this moment the Leafs are beating the Canucks. Wonders never cease. Heeee. :P
shaylyn29 on February 22nd, 2009 02:22 am (UTC)
LOL "My young apprentices" You're funny dude. Sure, tell a bunch of crazed Galactica fans to have patience with only 4 episodes left and nothing makes sense. And now I'm going to cry because I don't want it to end. LOL

On the other hand I see what you mean by not being accepted anymore even though he was/is the Chief. Being a Cylon takes all recognition out of everyone and puts a big neon sign on them. I saw it in the episode prior when Adama tells the Chief "human crew only." It's like "I'll accept you to work on my ship, but not the rest of your humanity killing cohorts." If that were me I'd be like "Yeah, thanks dude. I'll fix your ship then shove up it up your ass!!"
Aridirty_grrl on February 22nd, 2009 03:57 am (UTC)
Being patient is... really hard sometimes.
chani86 on February 22nd, 2009 11:51 am (UTC)
Oh I get what you're saying about the Chief never being accepted, I didn't see that perspective before and it makes me feel sorry for him and makes his decision to leave the galactica so much more understandable.

However, I don't really understand why Hotdog being Nicky's father means there's nothing tying Chief to galactia anymore. I suspected that's what they were setting up, when they revealed Hotdog as the father, but really if you believe a baby to be your child and you raise it for two(?) years, is the actual genetical fatherhood that important, more important than the relationship they've built up? I just found it hard to believe that he'd leave the child to Hotdog without the possibility of checking up on them and making sure Nicky would be okay.

okay that was horrible English, I could explain it better in German... thanks for the insights anyway!
odintsova_27: pjodintsova_27 on February 22nd, 2009 05:43 pm (UTC)
1. Have you seen the way he has been treated since he was revealed to be a Cylon.

Agreed! At first when the Chief voted not to stay I was all Tyrol WTF? But the Chief gave everything to Galactica and then when it was revealed that he was a Cylon, now no one (not even Adama, really) trust him the way they used to. That has to be tough. Plus, maybe he thought that him and Boomer could live happily ever after on the Baseship. Oh I hope so!
Annabellaannabella on February 24th, 2009 04:14 pm (UTC)
Having now watched the episode last night I just wanted to say that I really appreciate having your views on this ep before I watched it. The beginning seemed very choppy and was a little hard to follow and to some extent, the Chief's decision to leave Galactica did feel like it came out of nowhere. But I kept all of your excellent points in mind and was able to see the logic in his decision - though I'm glad they haven't all up and left yet.

I thought the moment at the end with Laura & Bill when they noticed the Cylons commemorating their own in the hallway was very telling. The human population may not be ready to accept the Cylons but I think Sam's right, the Cylons need to stay with the fleet - they're all stronger together than they are alone.